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Post by Gigermann on Sept 25, 2012 8:22:43 GMT -6
Looks like this one is getting bumped to the head of the queue (which, incidentally, puts it in position #2, where it already was…but nevermind that).
The press for characters/details is officially "on"
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Post by Gigermann on Sept 25, 2012 10:18:57 GMT -6
In the interest of spending less Friday-time dickering about details and more time actually killing things and taking their stuff, I'm going to try to get some of the necessary discussion started here. Things we need to determine (all of which will affect character choices and details): - How the company will be financed (required to determine all the other details about the company)
- What the primary focus of the company will be (bounty-hunting, courier, taxi, salvage, all of the above, etc)
- What the Big Bad of the campaign will be (Local cops, Feds, Gangs, others…)
- What the tone of the campaign will be (silly, serious, in-between; combat, non-combat, balanced)
- How much focus to put on the cars (doesn't need to be the centerpiece—could favor traditional cyberpunk more)
- Character point-levels (presuming ~250, but could easily start this one at a lower level)
For starters…
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Post by LabRat on Sept 25, 2012 10:32:44 GMT -6
Okay so from what I understand we are in this startup company that usually does jobs dealing with a typical merc setting.
For clarification, do we all own this company or do we work for some head boss (can either be NPC or PC). If we all own this company then maybe we need to think about if something tied us together previously that would put us in the position to go into the business together.
I think that depending on what characters we chose depends on what type of jobs we would be interested in taking. So far from the murmurings of players I've heard interest in people playing a driver, a courier, an undercover cop, with a mechanic and tech/hacker person as secondary characters. This of course isn't set in stone but it would help in determining the parameters of this business.
What alignment do you guys want to play? I would imagine that Rigil would lean more towards the side of good, while N8 would be more in the gray area (at least that is the typical MO for them). I personally am fine with either. Though we can always use the old Farscape/Firefly standby. Yeah we're Good GuysTM but that doesn't mean we can't get our hands dirty. I would think this would be the case considering the setting and our business.
We also need to discuss the antagonist of this operation. I think this might fall into place after we figure out the parameters of our business. Do we take smuggling jobs so we are having to deal with The Law? Are we in competition with other merc companies and so have adversaries that way. Do we have some really nasty clients that seemed okay in the beginning but then crossed into expecting us to do some truly dastardly deed.
How much time do we want to spend on the car aspect? Do we eat, breathe, and sleep auto or are they more of a tool when convenient?
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Post by LabRat on Sept 25, 2012 10:36:42 GMT -6
And of course while I was writing my previous post Giger already posted almost the same questions, only more succinct.
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Post by Gigermann on Sept 25, 2012 10:51:21 GMT -6
And of course while I was writing my previous post Giger already posted almost the same questions, only more succinct. Ah—was wondering why you just repeated what I said
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Post by thedefiantbudah on Sept 25, 2012 11:26:37 GMT -6
• How the company will be financed (required to determine all the other details about the company) • So on this subject, maybe work off Rigil’s idea a little and instead of him infiltrating a merc unit, the gov’t started one and posed a a “company” to get people to join up? • What the primary focus of the company will be (bounty-hunting, courier, taxi, salvage, all of the above, etc) • Does there have to actually be a focus, or can we do the “as long as the money’s there, we don’t care” type deal in order to lure in the big fish that Rigil’s character is trying to get…on there the other hand, that might come across as too sloppy for the “Big Bad” • What the Big Bad of the campaign will be (Local cops, Feds, Gangs, others…) • I’m ok with it being some big Drug Lord/Cartel and we (the party minus Rigil) are along for the ride and might be filled in or given details as to our employ later • What the tone of the campaign will be (silly, serious, in-between; combat, non-combat, balanced) • I’m a fan of balanced and in-between…cause if it’s just combat then anything that doesn’t require ammo or bloodshed will just be cinematic and wouldn’t require the skills…and even in a merc unit there has to be some down time, in the movie S.W.A.T. they were a focused unit when “on the clock” but cut loose when just them • How much focus to put on the cars (doesn't need to be the centerpiece—could favor traditional cyberpunk more) • With this question are you asking if the cars will almost be like PC’s or NPC’s or are you wanting to know how much detail do we want to put into them …I’m ok with them being in the backdrop (basically left to my aux character to maintain and upkeep, which that interaction can be done on here throughout the week) • Character point-levels (presuming ~250, but could easily start this one at a lower level) • I’m still a novice at the world of character building in GURPS, however I think the 250 would be a good start because the characters are going to have some xp under their belts before joining up in this unit…otherwise they wouldn’t be hired
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Post by Gigermann on Sept 25, 2012 11:30:51 GMT -6
Presuming most of you don't have GURPS Spaceships 2 with you ATM, here are the "Ships and Crews" sections that relate to purchase (which we will be using to finance the company): - Wealth—that is, taking the money out of your starting funds
- Financing—that is, a commercial loan
- Government Subsidies—another loan
- "Cheap and Used Ships"—in this case, taking over a pre-existing company, or their assets
- "Getting a Ship without Buying It"
- Someone else owns it
- Corporate branch
- Assigned by gov't—
not sure how that would work Chris' idea, part of a sting-type op - Payment for a job
- Assigned by criminal org
- Found it
- Stole it
Of course, any of these can be combined. Also, there might be other options not covered in this section.
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Post by Gigermann on Sept 25, 2012 11:36:37 GMT -6
With this question are you asking if the cars will almost be like PC’s or NPC’s or are you wanting to know how much detail do we want to put into them Rephrase: How much action/combat should be car-related I’m still a novice at the world of character building in GURPS, however I think the 250 would be a good start because the characters are going to have some xp under their belts before joining up in this unit…otherwise they wouldn’t be hired I equate the starting 150pt level to D&D Level 1-2, and 250pt to Level 5-6
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Post by thedefiantbudah on Sept 25, 2012 11:39:52 GMT -6
car-related action...65/35 where 35% happens with the cars (it's autoduel after all)
hmmmm, so maybe a 200pt and make it a 3/4 starting level?
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Post by LabRat on Sept 25, 2012 14:00:37 GMT -6
• How the company will be financed (required to determine all the other details about the company) I need to think on this a bit more. I want to try to do something different but nothing is coming to me that hasn’t already developed into its own cliché. I am not opposed to ChrisIII’s idea but I do have some slight concerns. Usually sting operations are mobile so you don’t establish yourself if one set place. Otherwise the bad guys will catch on to the fact that if they use No Seriously, We Don’t Work For The Government Salvage Depot they might get jail time like their buddies who used us previously. Second issue would be that we would have to run a pretty clean operation or else the Government could charge us with something. This might limit character creation. I am not saying that we shouldn’t do it, but I am just pointing some things out.
• What the primary focus of the company will be (bounty-hunting, courier, taxi, salvage, all of the above, etc) I think this needs to be decided once we have all of our character concepts hammered out. Maybe we can find a comment element that we can all specialize in. That would make everything fit a bit better. I would say I would prefer to be more specific than sporadic. Like dealing in a few related genera than just everything. However the down side of this would be potentially limiting our adventures to one type of operation.
• What the Big Bad of the campaign will be (Local cops, Feds, Gangs, others…). o This all depends on the first two questions. Once we have those figured out then this should easily fall into place.
• What the tone of the campaign will be (silly, serious, in-between; combat, non-combat, balanced) o In-between for the two. I think a little bit of camp would be fun. Like I remember N8 telling me about a scenario where futuristic names were based on commercialized products of the past. So someone would have the name Pepsi Volvo. We can still have serious bits but having a name like Mac Starburst is kinda funny. I also like balanced because that gives everyone a chance to shine if they aren’t that combat heavy of a PC.
• How much focus to put on the cars (doesn't need to be the centerpiece—could favor traditional cyberpunk more) o They need to be in there but I don’t think that the game needs to focus a lot of attention on them. Somewhere around 30-35%
• Character point-levels (presuming ~250, but could easily start this one at a lower level) o I would prefer 200 if possible. I haven’t had a lot of GURPS experience and I have found that I learn more if I am able to learn more if I work a character from the ground up. We do need experience to fit our setting but it doesn’t have to be a lot.
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Post by Gigermann on Sept 25, 2012 14:12:04 GMT -6
Another question for the hopper, which will affect the setting: Computers & networks. In the current "unmodified" Car Wars setting, there was a mass-virus wipeout that could easily result in a BSG-like retro-tech situation, which I kinda like (doesn't mean they won't be there, just that they won't be in everything like the direction RL is currently headed). OTOH, if we go that route, typical "hackers" aren't going to be a star-player, and it will be somewhat less "cyberpunk."
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Post by WxMAN on Sept 25, 2012 19:35:47 GMT -6
How the company will be financed (required to determine all the other details about the company) So here is my idea.... How about if our characters are all allies who began at a lower level and we are just now jumping into their lives... Before we 'jumped in' they had joined together to overcome a local oppressive gang/company/whatever.. Our characters defeat them and seize all of their assets... And we jump in... now what? We have a company with some assets, but now there is a local power vacuum that other groups will be desperately trying to fill... We just got big enough to be recognized regionally which could cause all other issues.... I figure that would turn the typical cliche of rags to riches by giving us some riches only to have to determine what we do with them... improve our local area? Become as iron-fisted as the people we deposed? Use that money to build an operation to take down further big fish? What the primary focus of the company will be (bounty-hunting, courier, taxi, salvage, all of the above, etc) Probably all of the above if we take the above suggestion What the Big Bad of the campaign will be (Local cops, Feds, Gangs, others…) Probably a little of everything, but people coming from all angles... police trying to keep us within their idea of the law... gangs seizing the power once we knocked the current top dog off the hill and trying to carve up the old empire... What the tone of the campaign will be (silly, serious, in-between; combat, non-combat, balanced) Cyberpunk lends itself to a gritty feel, I believe, which also necessitates a balanced but less "you see bad guys roll init" mentality How much focus to put on the cars (doesn't need to be the centerpiece—could favor traditional cyberpunk more) Cars could be kinda like spaceships that get you from island of civilization to island of civilization "safely" whereas most people travel reasonably light while actually inside of one of the "islands" Character point-levels (presuming ~250, but could easily start this one at a lower level) [/list]For starters…[/quote] 250 is good to me...
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Post by Rigil Kent on Sept 25, 2012 20:03:14 GMT -6
So here is my idea.... How about if our characters are all allies who began at a lower level and we are just now jumping into their lives... Before we 'jumped in' they had joined together to overcome a local oppressive gang/company/whatever.. Our characters defeat them and seize all of their assets... And we jump in... now what? We have a company with some assets, but now there is a local power vacuum that other groups will be desperately trying to fill... We just got big enough to be recognized regionally which could cause all other issues.... I figure that would turn the typical cliche of rags to riches by giving us some riches only to have to determine what we do with them... improve our local area? Become as iron-fisted as the people we deposed? Use that money to build an operation to take down further big fish? I rather like this idea.
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Post by LabRat on Sept 25, 2012 20:52:46 GMT -6
So here is my idea.... How about if our characters are all allies who began at a lower level and we are just now jumping into their lives... Before we 'jumped in' they had joined together to overcome a local oppressive gang/company/whatever.. Our characters defeat them and seize all of their assets... And we jump in... now what? We have a company with some assets, but now there is a local power vacuum that other groups will be desperately trying to fill... We just got big enough to be recognized regionally which could cause all other issues.... I figure that would turn the typical cliche of rags to riches by giving us some riches only to have to determine what we do with them... improve our local area? Become as iron-fisted as the people we deposed? Use that money to build an operation to take down further big fish? I rather like this idea. Agreed! This is the "something different" I was hoping for but wasn't bright enough to think of it on my own.
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Post by Gigermann on Sept 26, 2012 8:10:29 GMT -6
So far: - Company will start with some captured assets; need to determine how much, of what—this will likely come out of Starting Wealth as usual (Starting Wealth represents the total value of assets and cash available to the character at game-start)
- May still need further financing, after above
- Leaning toward all-of-the-above job focus
- Big Bad TBD by who you hit first and hardest(?)
- Standard mid-range tone
- Cars not the focus (action to be ~2:5 "vehicular")
- Leaning toward 200pts starting
Based on the post–seven-samurai kickoff, characters will be justified in purchasing Reputation based on their past exploits, for the local area or greater
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Post by Gigermann on Sept 27, 2012 10:30:20 GMT -6
Just something to chew on: I'm thinking about making the company a "character," with it's own CP-total, Ads & Disads, Reputation, etc.—and everyone in the company will be affected by those Traits, as long as they are (indentifiably) acting on its behalf
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Post by WxMAN on Sept 27, 2012 10:37:24 GMT -6
Sounds like a neat idea to me!
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Post by Gigermann on Sept 28, 2012 11:24:35 GMT -6
If everyone's on-board with the post–Seven-Samurai scenario, it will help a great deal to iron out the details of what occurred. Start thinking about it.
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Post by Rigil Kent on Sept 28, 2012 13:30:16 GMT -6
As a likely DEA agent, I'm on board with it being a big drug thing. Like the Big Bad (at the time) was a large gang type that were using some locals coerced into service to work on their drugs. Thus, the now defunct bad guys were not only trafficking with drugs, but were also do some slavery kind of stuff (which is a built-in plot hook for a PC or two as they hunt for their sibling/lover/parent/offspring.) It also provides other potential bad guys - dealers who relied on these guys are pissed they're gone, for example, and were they potentially working for someone (the nuBig Bad) who is miffed/impressed at our actions. A couple of questions/thoughts come to mind: - How powerful is the federal government at this point? How much bureaucratic oversight is in place? It seems to me that, in a world where autodueling is at least mostly legal, an undercover DEA agent might have a lot of leeway in terms of what he/she does.
- We need to develop the PC organization beforehand so I/we know how many advantage points need to go into it so we can build the characters.
- I'm leaning toward Abe being a faceman/manipulator type, but don't want him to end up being a Car Wars version of Jareth. I'm leaning toward him being more of a silent crusader type - the nuBig Bad has wronged him somehow or maybe it's just drugs in general, so he jockeyed hard to get this op with the eventual plan of him going off the reservation (and slapping that badge down on his boss' desk!)
- Do you have an overall "peek" at the city in terms of gangs and various organizations that we might run afoul of? If you've already posted that and I missed it, sorry.
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Post by Gigermann on Sept 28, 2012 14:10:47 GMT -6
A couple of questions/thoughts come to mind… Random thoughts: - If I stick with the Firefly background-elements, then the Fed power-level is going to be "normal"—I'm still debating about the specifics, though. CR is probably going to be higher (CR4/5?), but "guns" CR lower (CR2?). In retrospect, the addition of the 24 stuff requires a strong Fed power. Anyways, open for discussion.
- Counter-terrorist activity is going to be a big part of law-enforcement, with violent gangs; there will still be illegal drugs, but they will be more of an add-on crime that "defines" gang activity than a separate issue—maybe there isn't even a DEA anymore? Abe is as likely to be CTU as DEA—maybe moreso. Needs more definition; this is open for discussion.
- Terrorist groups of various stripes are a mainstay of Car Wars. The Anarchist Relief Front (ARF) is likely going to be a campaign villain unless the group leads me another direction
- I don't have any specifics on local gangs as yet; this is open for players' input, with a few things in mind:
- Two kinds: city-gangs (Robocop, Predator2, Dredd, The Crow) and Raiders (Mad Max, Reavers-Firefly); my expectation is that they're more "pirates" than "Boyz in the Hood"—some of them might actually be okay, just anarchs
- I mentioned Predator2 as a situational analogue, but I think it's probably more likely the "inevitable consequence" if things get more out-of-hand than the current state
- I had named The Rippers as a noteworthy gang—not sure whether it's just a motif, or they're not really bad guys (a more-direct rip-off of Tank Girl)—could go either way
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Post by Rigil Kent on Sept 28, 2012 14:36:09 GMT -6
CTU, huh? "We're running out of time, dammit!"
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Post by WxMAN on Sept 28, 2012 14:50:25 GMT -6
but don't want him to end up being a Car Wars version of Jareth. What's that supposed to mean?!?!
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Post by Rigil Kent on Sept 28, 2012 15:00:21 GMT -6
Put simply: I don't want him to be a scumbucket whom you tend to like even though every instinct in your body is telling you that's a bad idea.
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Post by Gigermann on Oct 1, 2012 14:26:19 GMT -6
@n8: Don't think I actually said it on Friday, but I have no problem with the "unusual" names. I've actually taken to using some unusual names in most of my sci-fi settings already. Specifically, I've been inspired by some names from Earth2 (True (f), Ulysses (m), Devon (f)), and a general trend of using surnames as given names (Chandler (m), McKenzie (f)), and some non-names (Jet (m), America (f), American (m)). I can see an eventuality where someone could end up with the name Pepsi Simmons—honestly, just look at NFL players . But then, I also like sing-song-y names, like in silver-age comics (Peter Parker, Lois Lane, Clark Kent, etc), and I also like to use names that either "mean something" or sound like they do.
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Post by Gigermann on Oct 2, 2012 12:45:44 GMT -6
Nobody responded to my "computers" question, but I think I've decided, for the sake of enabling the usual cyberpunk tropes, to keep the more modern computer/networking paradigm.
Unrelated note: Need a name for the company.
Also unrelated: I decided to nevermind the "Patron" angle on company assets—so much easier to just arbitrate a cash-amount and be done with it.
Additionally, unrelated: At the moment, I am intending to run the "prequel" in November, which is going to center around defending a megablock-apartment (probably the same megablock that the Shepards grew up in) from a gang (probably the Steel Vipers, depending on whether or not anyone takes them as a "permanent" Enemy)
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Post by Rigil Kent on Oct 2, 2012 17:22:05 GMT -6
Nobody responded to my "computers" question, but I think I've decided, for the sake of enabling the usual cyberpunk tropes, to keep the more modern computer/networking paradigm. I didn't even see the question. My bad. If we're right awesome good guys, we should be something like "Paladins, Inc." or "White Hats, LLC." "Judgement time..."
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Post by LabRat on Oct 3, 2012 9:25:43 GMT -6
Like Rigil, I also didn't see it. I am sorry. But if it makes you feel better, I would have opted to keep the modern elements regarding technology.
Hrm, I will have to think on this. I would like something kind of fun/clever and maybe keep with the cyberpunk theme. I don't know, something like AFK, Inc. Its a nod to something that would be nostalgia and it would indicate we go out and get stuff done.
Good, I thought the Patron thing was a bit complicated, but I didn't know if that was due to my lack of totally understanding GURPS or if it really was a big complicated.
This seems appropriate (of course I would imagine this idea may change depending on what the others post as their 3x3 once their characters are fleshed out). I am up for a little retribution while getting my feet wet.
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Post by thedefiantbudah on Oct 3, 2012 12:48:32 GMT -6
as far as the computer elements...i would say, depending on how far "post-apocalyptic" we are...maybe even tone them back from modern times a little to symbolize the rebuilding
will get back to you on the name
i'm with LabRat on the "patron" thing...didn't really understand it...although school has me a little scatterbrained atm
so...as far as the prequel goes...definitely need some fight skills...
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Post by WxMAN on Oct 3, 2012 13:47:02 GMT -6
So many questions I must of missed the computer one... since I am not overly familiar with cyberpunk to begin with I'd assume in this future corporations own 'sections' of the internet as do individual country governments/influential groups and treat it just like physical property/locations... let me know if I am way off base... As this is post world war time (from what I understand) lined infrastructure would likely be minimal and we'd rely more on satellite communications and whatnot for the 'internet'....
Maybe the name should be like Four Panel, Inc (reference to automobile's body being called panels and the old comics where the good guys were squeaky clean and the bad guys were all evil...).. I'm not good at naming things, that's a reason I married Labrat....
Patron thing is fine however you want to handle it... take it out of our CPs equally or out of our starting cash equally, no big deal to me... all works out the same...
Will the defense be located in Shepards' favorite part of the mega block-apartment?
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Post by Gigermann on Oct 3, 2012 14:06:06 GMT -6
So many questions I must of[sic] missed the computer one... I've already made my decision (as stated), but to clarify, the question, ultimately, was how prominent "hackery" was going to be in the campaign, by virtue of the setting's take on the state of computer technology—and I decided to take the more "traditional cyberpunk" approach, and leave computer tech as it currently exists, instead of setting it back (since both methods are equally plausible, given the source material). Will the defense be located in Shepards' favorite part of the mega block-apartment? I was thinking, essentially, of Dredd/ The Raid in reverse—BGs coming up from the ground-floor to the top, to throw out the defending PCs—but that's really going to be up to your strategic efforts at game-time; wherever you want to make your stand is where it happens
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